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Having checked, this is still better. Can be used round after round (not a maneuver), scales better, slightly harder saving throw, and (importantly for this debate) actually usable by a random expert at level 1.The Scholar can recover it as a swift action, which renders the more important of those complaints moot.
Still afforable by anyone 1st level with decent skills.Any expert willing to spend one of (maybe) two feats on this. Again, that's a very poor choice given that you could be spending that feat on something more likely to make you money and less likely to get you killed.
Why the objection to building cities, society and wanting to take prisioners alive?What the hell are you talking about? This has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion.
You've been arguing for several posts for shooting people more than 50 feet away. When my example was specifically in a town. That, once more, has buildings and stuff that block line of sight. Forests have trees. Mountains have rocks. Only in a featurless plain can you keep moving backward every single turn while keeping a clear line of fire.The feat requires that you be able to see your target too. Which, surprise surprise, requires line of sight. So those things benefit the ranged attacker as well.
But nice attempt at turning away the dicussion once more.
The noteworthy result is that this bypasses basically all defenses and allows for large groups of mooks to easily take out much higher level enemies automatically whitout need of any roll.Except that it doesn't? Because these "much higher level enemies" are making the save easily, taking trivial amounts of damage, and wiping out the mooks, who had to get within spitting distance to attack.
It's doable with a single level in Scholar.QuoteReally, the fact that you are arguing against something that can deal a paltry amount of automatic damage at close range at level 1 is laughable when I can look into your own homebrew and find something that will do exactly that.
Can we just check that this, whatever it is, is something freely available to the general populace and not contingent on a particular setting or species (especially one that doesn't have hands or something)?
If you give the other side loads of extra cash out of nowhere, certainly.But feats are not, funnily enough.
Hint:longbows are 75 GP each, actually out of reach of most 1st level people. Arrows aren't cheap either. Words are free.
Funny, I could swear you could make money out of skills alone, and that experts had those to spare.Then why the objection to the longbow?
That you were trying to turn away the discussion to irrelevant stuff. And still are now, with now empty featurless plains instead of towns (that have, you know, buildings and other stuff to block line of sight while one aproaches) while granting your side massive wealth bonus out of nowhere.Who said anything about featureless plains? When you're willing to talk straight instead of putting words into my mouth, come back to this argument.
Experts have 1d4 hp, +4 temporary (assuming four guys lined up directly behind them).Temporary hit points from the same effect don't stack.
Basically, odds are that they'll survive any one attack he makes. This is assuming he hits, because he only has a +1 to hit, and they're armoured (because talking isn't impaired by armour). So, one round buffing, next round simply moving.What makes you think the guy with the superior range on his weapon is going to stop moving when they're moving toward him? If they don't stop moving, you don't either, and depending on your armor compared to theirs, you might be gaining some distance. At worst, you're staying out of range.
Hell, 'one guy with a longbow' isn't going to be able to take down an entire group before he's mobbed.
I was explaining how they could get into range of this one guy with a longbow without all being immediately dead. And, hell, the amount of damage doesn't matter if you're talking a guy with 1d8+con HP.But they can't get in range. If they're just discouraging, that's a standard action, so they can only take a move action, which longbow guy does as well. If they're discouraging and encouraging to turtle up, that's a full-attack action, so they can only five-foot step. In neither case can they catch up with the guy.
... where are you producing a competent militia from? :OSo how high level are these militia experts? Because they don't get iterative attacks until 8th level, so they can't encourage each other and still toss insults at 1st level unless they opted for the TWFing route, in which case they're still getting, what, two temporary hit points? Three, if we're generous and giving every single one the elite array. Their offense is also three hit points worth of nonlethal damage, or one if the target makes a piddling DC 12 Will save, and can only be used on targets within 20 feet. Meanwhile, one guy with a longbow can plink away at them with impunity.
We are assuming these are only level 1's, right? Everyone's made of glass. Later on, when the normal militia is more likely to survive, the experts are much more capable of jeering everything to death.
If you get enough, you can have the experts further back encourage those ahead of them, and those in the front row encourage whoever's to either side, and everyone gets temporary hitpoints as they shuffle forwards wearing armour they can't use but which doesn't impair their ability to insult everyone to the grave.
You don't need a feat simply to make stuff, humans make up a large percentage of the population, and experts have enough skillpoints for something like this. Turn a crowd of experts into the city army. Problem solved. Armour check penalties don't matter if there's no attack roll.If you're doing that, you have a bunch of untrained experts dealing a point of damage if they get within 20 feet of something. Or you could get an actual militia that knows what it's doing and can't be mowed down by any idiot with a longbow.
Why not? Marauders do what they have to do to get loot.Because then they'll all be slaughtered by someone that wanted to do actual damage?
Experts make a significant part of town population, otherwise there wouldn't be a city to begin with, since commoners in overwhelming majority do not make such a place.And these experts will all have spent their feats on doing something likely to get them beaten to a pulp rather than something that could have brought them an actual livelihood, yes. That sounds like it makes sense.
Missed attacks don't deal damage. This deals damage whetever you make the save or not.So does Fireball. Your point being?
This kinda makes both heroes and solo monsters obsolete unless they're blind or deaf.Most roving bands of marauders aren't going to be trained in diplomacy or oration.
The orc raider band no longer bother trying to kill you with pointy sticks. They just throw insults at you for auto-nonlethal damage regardless of your defences until you colapse. You're immune to nonlethal damage? Excellent! You're taking actual damage in that case, and then you're finished off with splash damage from an alchemical flask.
Try to piss off the townsfolk. You'll end up crying on the floor discouraged before you can do anything else. There's also no quest for taking care of that wandering angry giant. His natural and manufactured armor was no match for the villager's boos and hisses.Commoners get precisely none of the prerequisites as class skills, so unless your towns are populated with super-peasants...
Also an auto-pick for martial users, because who doesn't love auto-hiting maneuvers to make sure the carrier effect always lands? With extra range added in for free.The intent is pretty clearly that if your target makes their save, the attack is treated as though it had missed (although clarifying text to that point would be good).