How to be a tank in D&D?

[darqueseid]

Please pick up to three qualities, in order of importance, IE: If you feel that more than three are important pick the top three.

If you pick other, please post the quality you have in mind.

If you feel a quality is totally irrellevant post your opinion.

[Basket Burner]

Ask an old man that seems gentle but really isn't, make random pop culture references to annoy him, and then approach him so that you might see.

If you want a serious response, make the poll questions have some relation to the main topic itself.

[ariasderros]

...make the poll questions have some relation to the main topic itself.

+1.

[darqueseid]

roger, renamed topic

[ariasderros]

Seems to be quite the consensus in the votes so far.

Also, the best tank is an expendable one, this is why Malconvokers pwn.

[ImperatorK]

I voted like everyone else, apparently, but I would say that all the options are important for a tank in D&D.

[altpersona]

i agree that disposable is a nice quality.

and i think the first option (take/avoid damage) is pretty much the same as (large hit point pool)

[X-Codes]

I voted Other, because I think the limit of 3 options is ridiculous.

You need to do just about all of the above.  The ability to dish damage isn't itself important, but that's often how you're going to get the enemy to focus attacks on you: by being a threat.  Similarly, having high HP and saves (not just Fort and Ref, but Will, too) are going to be how you absorb/mitigate damage.  Finally, while you yourself have to be a threat, you will absolutely never be the only threat: you're part of a party, afterall.  So to deal with the enemies that try to get around you as a threat and attack the other threats, you need to be able to control the battlefield to some extent.

So yeah... just about the only thing on that list that isn't strictly necessary is the ability to dish out copious amounts of damage, but that's often something that kinda has to happen anyway.

[ariasderros]

and i think the first option (take/avoid damage) is pretty much the same as (large hit point pool)

I read that as resistances and reductions. DR 30/Epic > 300 HP in most fights.

@ X-codes, you seem to be forgetting the locke-down build. "you try to do anything, I make you stop. you do nothing, I still make you stop."

[X-Codes]

@ X-codes, you seem to be forgetting the locke-down build. "you try to do anything, I make you stop. you do nothing, I still make you stop."

In regards to what?  That's one specific build.  There are more tanks out there than just lock-down fighters.

[veekie]

But ultimately, most of that is just, ways to draw fire, and ways to endure fire. Thats all tanking really is. Everything else is optional or details.

[ariasderros]

@ X-codes, you seem to be forgetting the locke-down build. "you try to do anything, I make you stop. you do nothing, I still make you stop."

In regards to what?  That's one specific build.  There are more tanks out there than just lock-down fighters.

My point was, you do not need to do everything to be a good tank, as you espouse. You can specialize, and min-max that specialization, to be a good tank.

[Basket Burner]

There is no such thing. Enemies are always going to attack the greatest threat. While that could very well be you, if you're in the tank mentality it won't. It will be someone else. And perhaps they can even take it by Mirror Imaging in their face, etc, and that's technically tanking but the focus is on eliminating the enemies and the defenses are simply a matter of surviving long enough to do that and not the focus itself.

[weenog]

There is no such thing. Enemies are always going to attack the greatest threat. While that could very well be you, if you're in the tank mentality it won't. It will be someone else. And perhaps they can even take it by Mirror Imaging in their face, etc, and that's technically tanking but the focus is on eliminating the enemies and the defenses are simply a matter of surviving long enough to do that and not the focus itself.

So you're saying the most important quality is to be able to avoid damage, specifically by way of forcing the enemy not to attack anyone?

[ariasderros]

There is no such thing. Enemies are always going to attack the greatest threat. While that could very well be you, if you're in the tank mentality it won't. It will be someone else. And perhaps they can even take it by Mirror Imaging in their face, etc, and that's technically tanking but the focus is on eliminating the enemies and the defenses are simply a matter of surviving long enough to do that and not the focus itself.

Not necessarily, A wizard can have up what they would consider "basic defenses" and then unleash battlefield control spells and debuffs (being god) and end up as the tank. This is an example of someone who is the epitomical tank, but doesn't realize that's what he is.

[Basket Burner]

There is no such thing. Enemies are always going to attack the greatest threat. While that could very well be you, if you're in the tank mentality it won't. It will be someone else. And perhaps they can even take it by Mirror Imaging in their face, etc, and that's technically tanking but the focus is on eliminating the enemies and the defenses are simply a matter of surviving long enough to do that and not the focus itself.

So you're saying the most important quality is to be able to avoid damage, specifically by way of forcing the enemy not to attack anyone?

No, the goal is eliminating enemies. Defenses only come up because they're also trying to eliminate you. It's not about "tanking" though, it's about finishing the fight as quickly as possible. If you can kill them before they move so much the better but that isn't always possible.

What's more, in addition to suggesting a defensive focus that is counterproductive the word tank also suggests there's only one such person. If there is, far too much pressure will be put on them and your core will be broken (read: they die, everyone else dies after that). You need everyone able to survive focus fire as in a decent party there's more than one threat. Therefore while someone is going to be getting focus fired it's not always the same person.

[InnaBinder]

In choosing "other", I mean to broaden the "focus enemy fire onto themselves" into "remove as much choice as possible over which ally the enemies target".  I could see situations where a combination of battlefield control and chicanery could force the enemy to hit his own ally, which I find vastly preferable over even hitting the Tank or the Tank's pet.

[darqueseid]

Thanks for the great feedback and discussion everyone!

The reason I limited the poll to three is that I wanted to get the "best" answer(s).  I agree that all things above could be valuable to a tank, indeed I was actively trying to list everything I could think of that would be valuable to a tank.   My goal is to narrow down what the best thing to be doing as a "tank", the quintessential need(s) that the tank serves in a party.   

[Basket Burner]

Thanks for the great feedback and discussion everyone!

The reason I limited the poll to three is that I wanted to get the "best" answer(s).  I agree that all things above could be valuable to a tank, indeed I was actively trying to list everything I could think of that would be valuable to a tank.   My goal is to narrow down what the best thing to be doing as a "tank", the quintessential need(s) that the tank serves in a party.

Do I need to give the momentum speech?

[ariasderros]

Thanks for the great feedback and discussion everyone!

The reason I limited the poll to three is that I wanted to get the "best" answer(s).  I agree that all things above could be valuable to a tank, indeed I was actively trying to list everything I could think of that would be valuable to a tank.   My goal is to narrow down what the best thing to be doing as a "tank", the quintessential need(s) that the tank serves in a party.

Do I need to give the momentum speech?

Do you think there would be a point?